Quiz – Scott Rolen (solved)

46 Replies

Scott Rolen completed a distinguished career last season, joining an exclusive group of only 30 players with 300 home runs and 500 doubles. But, he also joined the even more exclusive group below of retired players since 1901 with a particular career accomplishment.

What is the accomplishment that distinguishes the players in this group?

Player
Jake Daubert
Ozzie Smith
Joe Kuhel
Fred McGriff
Luis Aparicio
Wally Joyner
George McQuinn
Lou Whitaker
Tino Martinez
J.T. Snow
Chris Chambliss
Scott Rolen

Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used
Generated 4/22/2013.

Hint: the answer uses only basic statistics found on the back of many baseball cards

Congratulations to Josh and GrandyMan who teamed up to identify these 12 players as the infielders with 1500 games since 1901 (including 150 after their age 35 season) who played only one defensive position for their entire careers. There are another 12 players (see comment #8) who have the same feat except for the playing time after their age 35 seasons.

The games leaders for retired position players who have appeared in only one defensive position.

C – Rick Ferrell (1884)
1B – Fred McGriff (2460), Joe Kuhel (2104, no DH)
2B – Lou Whitaker (2390), Bobby Doerr (1865, no DH)
3B – Scott Rolen (2038)
SS – Luis Aparicio (2601). Derek Jeter should pass Aparicio this season; could be interesting to see if he plays anywhere else as his career winds down.
LF – Johnny Johnston (111), Matt Holliday is active leader at 1310, incl. DH.
CF – Brian McRae (1354), Johnny Rucker (705, no DH)
RF – Harry Lumley (730)
OF – Rickey Henderson (3081), Lou Brock (2616, no DH)
DH – David Ortiz and Travis Hafner are only players with 1000+ games, incl. 80% at DH

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Josh

11 years ago

Most of the players are world class defensive players, and all of them were predominantly infielders. Beyond that, I got nothing.

Richard Chester

11 years ago

There are 8 first-basemen, 2 shortstops, a second-baseman and a third-baseman.

Author

Doug

11 years ago

Playing in the infield is part of the answer.

Josh

11 years ago

1500+ games while only playing one defensive position, which happens to be in the infield?

Author

Doug

11 years ago

Reply to Josh

That’s most of it.

One more piece. To help you, here are infielders NOT in the quiz, but who also played 1500 games at only one defensive position. What’s the difference between the two groups?

Player
Larry Doyle
John Mayberry
Bobby Doerr
Luis Castillo
Frank Bolling
Willie Kamm
Home Run Baker
Wally Pipp
Derrek Lee
Will Clark
Eric Karros
John Olerud

Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used
Generated 4/22/2013.

Richard Chester

11 years ago

Reply to Doug

The guys in the first group never had a headache. 🙂

Chris C

11 years ago

Reply to Doug

Hmm. Both groups of players have not been in my kitchen.

brp

11 years ago

Reply to Doug

Why isn’t Jeter on either list? Because of DH’ing?

Chris C

11 years ago

Reply to brp

Retired players only.

brp

11 years ago

Reply to Chris C

You miss one little word…

oneblankspace

11 years ago

I’ll see Josh’s answer #4 and raise it to 2000GP with only one defensive position, and it’s infield. Alan Trammell played some other positions briefly in his career (looking for something Whitaker did and Trammell did not).

11 years ago

Reply to oneblankspace

No, I think Josh has it. Some of these guys didn’t play 2,000 games.

Richard Chester

11 years ago

They all participated in post-season play, does that have anything to do with it?

Author

Doug

11 years ago

Reply to Richard Chester

Nothing about post-season.

no statistician but

11 years ago

Off the wall:

They all had multiple seasons in which they hit the same number of home runs. Probably just a coincidence, but it was weird going down the list and finding this to be so.

Author

Doug

11 years ago

Reply to no statistician but

Weird, indeed.

But, I hadn’t noticed that.

Richard Chester

11 years ago

Reply to Doug

I did some random checking. Every player I came across had multiple seasons with the same number of home runs including the guys on the second list.

11 years ago

Reply to Richard Chester

Daubert was an expert at hitting exactly two home runs a year!!! 🙂

no statistician but

11 years ago

Reply to Richard Chester

RC:

What I was really noting was, for example: Aparicio hit 3 three times, 4 three times, 5 three times, 6 three times; Rolen hit 5, 8, 11, 26, 31 all twice.

Mike L

11 years ago

Speaking of multiple seasons of the same number of HR’s, Adam Dunn had four consecutive seasons of 40, and two other seasons of 38. He is also having a remarkable start to 2013. 73PA, 3HR, 6RBI, 27K, and a slash line of .101/.151/.246 with an OPS+ of 6.
BTW, he’s a sort of one man statistical oddity machine. He’s had seasons of 100, 101, 102, 103, 105 and 106 RBI. Could this be the year he fills in the inside straight?

Mike A.

11 years ago

Reply to Mike L

Maybe with his batting average!

deal

11 years ago

1) I am pretty sure I heard Rolen isn’t officially retired.
2) According to Jay Jaffe’s JAWS ranking for 3B every person ahead of Rolen thtat is eligible for the HoF is a member, with the exception of Edgar Martinez (Whos #1 POS is of course not 3B anyway)

http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/jaws_3B.shtml

Apparently Rolen never even DHd, not in interleague and Not in 2 Yrs w/ the Blue Jays.

Author

Doug

11 years ago

Reply to deal

B-R is showing Rolen as retired.

For our single position players, I believe Rolen, Ozzie Smith and Luis Castillo are the only ones from the DH era (plus Luis Aparicio, for one season) who never DHed. Of course, the only games Smith played in an AL park were in the World Series, as inter-league play started the year after Ozzie retired.

bstar

11 years ago

Reply to deal

I’m with you, deal. I heard Rolen wasn’t done yet either. I hope he’s not.

Wikipedia lists him as a free agent. This link says the Dodgers and Reds offered him $4 million but he wants guaranteed playing time.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/scott_rolen/

mosc

11 years ago

Is the last piece of this “who never started 162 games in any season?”

mosc

11 years ago

Reply to mosc

Let me rephrase: who never lead the league in games started in a year at their position?

Author

Doug

11 years ago

Reply to mosc

Not that.

The last piece, though, is related to games played, but for a certain part of a career.

GrandyMan

11 years ago

Reply to Doug

250 games played after turning 35?

mosc

11 years ago

Reply to GrandyMan

Looks about right. Age related cutoff. Clark played at 35 and 36 so it’s gotta be ab related around those years.

Author

Doug

11 years ago

Reply to Doug

Okay. I’ll give it to you guys. It’s actually 150 games after the age 35 season. Only reason for doing that was to make for a manageable list of 12 guys, instead of 24.

Richard Chester

11 years ago

Hey Doug, I’ve got a quiz for you. What feat have only these players accomplished between 1916 and 1955? It has been accomplished at least three dozen times since then. I retrieved the data using PI.

Don Hurst
Danny Taylor
Spud Davis
Hank Greenberg
Mickey Haslin
Zeke Bonura
Elbie Fletcher
Butch Nieman
Bobby Doerr
Stan Spence
Granny Hamner
Joe Collins

Author

Doug

11 years ago

Reply to Richard Chester

Got nothing so far, Richard.

Would seem that Butch Nieman is the guy to focus on, as he played only 3 seasons. Are you looking for a game feat, or a season feat?

Incidentally, looking at Nieman, found he had a quirky feat shared with only these players in that 1916-1955 period.


Butch Nieman
Joe Kuhel
Jack Dittmer
Herman Bronkie
Bill Rariden
Hal Janvrin

Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used
Generated 4/23/2013.

Richard Chester

11 years ago

Reply to Doug

It is a game feat.

Author

Doug

11 years ago

Reply to Doug

All of them had a game with exactly 2 solo HRs and no other runs scored or driven in.

But, so did a lot of other guys – must be something else about those games.

Doug

11 years ago

Reply to Doug

BTW, the players in comment #31 had a season (min. 200 PAs) in 1916 to 1955 with identical totals for Runs, Walks and Strikeouts.

Butch Nieman turned that trick in his first season. In his second season, he had identical Walk and Strikeout totals. In his third and last season, he had identical Run and Walk totals.

Editor

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Richard Chester

I took a wild swing, Richard — 2 HRs & 3 Ks in a game — but only Greenberg and Luke Easter did that from 1916-1955 (actually, through 1964). It’s happened 45 times since 1965, starting with Joe Torre, then Bobby Bonds. Chili Davis & Jay Buhner did it twice.

Richard Chester

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

It was not too wild a swing that you took.

Editor

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Richard Chester

OK, based on Nieman & Fletcher, I’m guessing: 2 HRs in a game their team won 2 to __.

Richard Chester

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

You’re getting close, just fill in the blank. It can only be one of two numbers

Editor

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

2-1, that’s what I saw with Nieman & Fletcher. I hedged ’cause I didn’t want to check the other guys. 🙂

Editor

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Richard Chester

By the way, Richard, can you explain exactly how you got that via the P-I? Don’t tell me you set HR=2 and RBI=2 and checked all the results!

Richard Chester

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

I did that and checked the team won box. Then I sorted the results spreadsheet by the game result column and looked for 2-1 games. Really easy. The most significant of those games was Greenberg’s on 9-10-34. The Tigers were engaged in a tight pennant race and the Jewish New Year fell on that date. Torn between playing or not playing he went for advice from a Detroit rabbi who advised that he could play because it was a joyous holiday. He responded with his 2 HRs for a 2-1 victory.

Brent

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

Richard @39: Ah, the subject of one of my favorite baseball poems: (forgive the non political correctness of a couple lines, it was written in 1934). The Irish didn’t like it when they heard of Greenberg’s fame For they thought a good first baseman should possess an Irish name; And the Murphys and Mulrooneys said they never dreamed they’d see A Jewish boy from Bronxville out where Casey used to be. In the early days of April not a Dugan tipped his hat Or prayed to see a “double” when Hank Greenberg came to bat. In July the Irish wondered… Read more »

Author

Doug

11 years ago

Reply to Richard Chester

Nice one, Richard.

Editor

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Richard Chester

Well done. I had assumed there would be far more than one page of results, even for 1916-55. Wrong I was!

Richard Chester

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

I found two pages of results. The second page had 15 names. I chose a small number of years to keep the list short and also to include an old Yankee favorite of mine, Joe Collins. I stayed away from the more recent years because I thought that you or Doug might remember that Ike Davis did it for the Mets last year (8-26-2012).