Circle of Greats: Redemption Round #2

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This Circle of Greats vote is not to induct anyone into the Circle, but only to select two players who will be restored back on to the main ballot after having been previously been dropped from eligibility. This second “redemption round” (we also held one after the 1960 round of voting) gives voters a chance to reconsider past candidates that have been rejected. Rules and lists are after the jump.

In this round you may include on your three-man ballot any player who was born between 1950 and 1968 and has neither been elected to the Circle of Greats nor is currently ballot-eligible in the regular COG voting. As usual, you must vote for three and only three guys to cast a qualifying ballot. The two guys who appear on the most ballots will be restored to eligibility for the next regular, induction round of of COG voting. If your personal favorite doesn’t come in the top two this time, do not despair — he will have other chances in future redemption rounds, which are currently scheduled to be held once after every decade’s worth of regular induction rounds (after the 1940 round, the 1930 round, etc.) .

The first list below of candidates for your consideration includes all 19 players who have received more than two votes in past induction rounds, but who are not currently eligible to be on the ballot. The list is in alphabetical order by last name. The second list below, again as a list of guys for you to consider, are the 14 players who have received exactly two votes in past induction rounds, once again listed in alphabetical order. These are only suggestions, they are not restrictive lists: to repeat, you can vote for whoever you want among those born from 1950 through 1968 as long as they are not already in the COG or on the regular ballot.

Players who were born 1950-1968 and have received more than two votes in previous COG induction rounds but are currently ineligible for the next ballot:

Buddy Bell
Kevin Brown
Andre Dawson
Dennis Eckersley
John Franco
Rich Gossage
Ron Guidry
Keith Hernandez
Trevor Hoffman
Jeff Kent
Kenny Lofton
Edgar Martinez
Fred McGriff
Don Mattingly
Dale Murphy
Kirby Puckett
Dan Quisenberry
Willie Randolph
Dave Stieb

Players who were born 1950-1968 and have received exactly two votes in previous COG induction rounds and are currently ineligible for the next ballot:

Will Clark
Danny Darwin
Orel Hershiser
Jimmy Key
Greg Luzinski
Jamie Moyer
John Olerud
Rafael Palmeiro
Dave Parker
Fernando Valenzuela
Andy Van Slyke
Omar Vizquel
Frank White
Willie Wilson

The deadline to cast your ballots in this redemption round is Tuesday night, July 2 at 11PM EDT. You can change your votes until 11PM EDT on Sunday, June 30. You can keep track of the vote tally in this redemption round here: Redemption Round 2 COG Vote Tally

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Editor

Dalton Mack

11 years ago

Brown, Lofton, Randolph

Mike

11 years ago

Quisenberry
Eckersley
Gossage

Mike

11 years ago

Quisenberry
Eckersley
Gossage

I hope I don’t lose my voting rights for selecting 3 relievers.

Author

birtelcom

11 years ago

Reply to Mike

As relievers have not exactly been warmly embraced by the COG voters thus far, seeing them get support in the redemption round is not surprising.

Dr. Doom

11 years ago

Kevin Brown
Edgar Martinez
Kenny Lofton

Three guys from basically the same era, and I think they’re legitimately the best three off the ballot. Next on my list were Bret Saberhagen, Mark McGwire, and David Cone, in case anyone’s curious, though I doubt you are.

oneblankspace

11 years ago

Quisenberry, WClark, Luzinski

Chris C

11 years ago

Edgar Martinez, Kirby Puckett, Will Clark

Aidan Mattson

11 years ago

Dawson, Eckersley and Mattingly

Hartvig

11 years ago

Martinez, Lofton, Brown

Mike HBC

11 years ago

I’m keeping two of my previous Redemption Round votes and changing the last one:

Jim Abbott
Curtis Pride
Dale Murphy

For the record, I will be voting for Abbott and Pride in every single Redemption Round.

brp

11 years ago

Reply to Mike HBC

What, no Jim Eisenreich?

Lofton
Randolph
Eckersley

If we HAVE to have a reliever in the COG I’d prefer it be someone who started.

I fully expect none of these guys to make it all the way through and do sort of question the point of these rounds when we already have too many qualified candidates, if anything, but hey – “that’s just my opinion, I could be wrong.”

Mike HBC

11 years ago

Reply to brp

There are plenty of players with stories of defeating harsh adversity, but I’ve never found any quite as inspiring as Abbott- who I voted for during his actual ballot in 1967 and would absolutely vote for again given the same situation- and Pride. However, you are absolutely right- Eisenreich’s tale is quite impressive and incredible. So, considering that I think the Redemption Round is ridiculous anyway, that I feel all of these players are worthier of adoration than the rest of the candidates, and that I already have a former Brave (Pride) on my ballot, I’m changing my ballot to:… Read more »

brp

11 years ago

Reply to Mike HBC

Well I just figured Dale Murphy seemed like the odd man out and was trying to round out the group, and Eisenreich seemed to fit the best 🙂

There really are a lot of good choices as INH points out in #45. This is just tough.

Mike HBC

11 years ago

Reply to brp

My third choice was Jeff Blauser last time, so I was sticking with Braves, but you were correct to point out someone else deserving of my vote. It’s not that there aren’t great players who are currently off the ballot; it’s that none of them will ever get elected to the CoG, so what’s the point of these redemption rounds? Now there will be two more players who will stick around for a few rounds and then drop off again. Whoop de do. I love Kenny Lofton, but he’s not getting into the CoG, and I’d rather vote for Jim… Read more »

Darien

11 years ago

Kenny Lofton
Fred McGriff
Jeff Kent

Nick Pain

11 years ago

Palmeiro, Lofton, Kevin Brown

bstar

11 years ago

Lofton, Palmeiro, Dawson

11 years ago

Kevin Brown, Edgar Martinez, Kenny Lofton

Jeff Harris

11 years ago

Edgar Martinez, Kenny Lofton, Quisenberry

Brent

11 years ago

Quiz cause I love him. The Goose because he was better than the Quiz and hmm, Kenny Lofton.

--bill

11 years ago

Edgar Martinez, Kevin Brown, Kenny Lofton

Kirk

11 years ago

Puckett, Palmeiro Gosage

Artie Z.

11 years ago

Edgar Martinez, Kenny Lofton, and Keith Hernandez

koma

11 years ago

Dennis Eckersley, Trevor Hoffman, Jamie Moyer

Dr. Remulak

11 years ago

Hoffman, Gossage, Mattingly.

Andy

11 years ago

Lofton
Martinez
Brown

Bix

11 years ago

Eckersley, Martinez, Brown

donburgh

11 years ago

Willie Randolph
Dale Murphy
Dave Parker

Lawrence Azrin

11 years ago

– Jeff Kent (most HR by a 2nd baseman)
– Kevin Brown

Author

birtelcom

11 years ago

Reply to Lawrence Azrin

Just two names?

Lawrence Azrin

11 years ago

Reply to Lawrence Azrin

Take two:

– Kevin Brown
– Jeff Kent
– Edgar Martinez

11 years ago

Steib, Eckersly, Hershheiser

Abbott

11 years ago

Lofton, Kent, Eck

Author

birtelcom

11 years ago

25 ballots cast so far, 24 different candidates named on at least one ballot. Good to see a wide diversity of choices.

ATarwerdi96

11 years ago

Rafael Palmeiro, Edgar Martinez, Kevin Brown

mosc

11 years ago

Sheffield, Gossage, Mattingly

Richard Chester

11 years ago

Mattingly, Puckett, Martinez

Gary Bateman

11 years ago

Eckersley, Mattingly & Murphy

aweb

11 years ago

Brown, Lofton, Dawson

Chad

11 years ago

Lofton, Edgar Martinez, Will Clark

CursedClevelander

11 years ago

Ooh, this is tough. Hmm…

Kenny Lofton
Edgar Martinez
Goose Gossage

I remember, when Joe Posnanski and others were obsessed with Quiz vs. Sutter, he had a post about how fantastic The Goose was with inherited runners. This was before Goose made the Hall of Fame. Career 41.9 bWAR puts him above everybody in the expansion era but Rivera.

Author

birtelcom

11 years ago

Welcome to the voting, CC. Looking at b-ref’s inherited runners (IR) numbers, I see:
Sutter allowed 137 of 445 IRs to score, which is about 31%
Gossage allowed 277 of 832 IRs to score. about 33%
Quisenberry allowed 201 of 523 IRs to score, about 38%

Quis averaged only 3.3 Ks per 9 IP for his career, Gossage 7.5 and Sutter 7.9. A high K/9 rate is probably a good modus operandi for preventing inherited runners from scoring.

Voomo Zanzibar

11 years ago

Kevin Brown
Kenny Lofton
Willie Randolph

Mike L

11 years ago

Edgar Martinez, Gossage, and, for the first time on my ballot, Willie Randolph.

Editor

Doug

11 years ago

Brown, Stieb, Lofton

For 1982-90, Stieb was 2nd in ERA+, 4th in IP and 5th in W-L%. He also won at least 13 games in 8 of those 9 seasons, tied for the most with Morris and Welch.
For his peak years 1982-85, Stieb was 1st in ERA+ (nobody was close to him), 1st in IP, and 3rd in WHIP.

Jeff

11 years ago

Will “The Thrill” Clark (if only his back didn’t cost him so many games and made an early retirement)…
Jeff Kent (greatest HR hitting 2nd baseman EVER)…
Kenny Lofton(arguably the best leadoff hitter sandwiched between Rickey(80’s) and Ichiro(00’s)…

Insert Name Here

11 years ago

Alright, here’s my initial vote by my WAR/162 method, taking EVERYONE into account, not just the players listed here: 1. Kevin Appier (7.0 WAR/162 during 1990-97) 2. Kenny Lofton (6.7 WAR/162 during 1992-99) 3. Dave Stieb (7.0 WAR/162 during 1980-85) Other players I wouldn’t mind seeing on the ballot again: 4. Bret Saberhagen (6.8 WAR/162 during 1985-91) 5. David Cone (6.3 WAR/162 during 1988-99) 6. César Cedeño (6.9 WAR/162 during 1972-77) 7. Andre Dawson (6.9 WAR/162 during 1978-83) 8. Buddy Bell (6.7 WAR/162 during 1978-84) 9. Chet Lemon (6.5 WAR/162 during 1977-84) 10. Edgar Martínez (6.4 WAR/16 during 1995-2001) 11.… Read more »

Author

birtelcom

11 years ago

Reply to Insert Name Here

Interesting that Appier appeared on only one ballot back in the 1967 vote. Kudos for bringing his name back into the discussion.

Insert Name Here

11 years ago

Reply to birtelcom

I believe I voted for him in the last redemption round, and in that 1967 vote. It’s extremely underrated, particularly for his peak years, and I’ve always thought it’s a shame that he never got much support in the COG voting.

Author

birtelcom

11 years ago

Reply to Insert Name Here

Indeed, yours was the one vote cast for Kevin in the 1967 round, and one of three votes cast for Appier in the last redemption round. Cone, Stieb and Appier, among those eligible in this round, are all quite close in some core career stats.

David Horwich

11 years ago

Lofton, Edgar Martinez, McGriff

I have mixed feelings about the redemption process. It seems to me unlikely that anyone who gets redeemed is actually going to make it into the CoG (because if they have enough support to make it, they wouldn’t have fallen off the ballot in the first place), and will probably fall back off the ballot within a round or two. If so, the redemption process is merely an academic exercise that further clogs up the holdover list.

But I’m voting anyway….

mosc

11 years ago

Reply to David Horwich

I wish it happened in parallel with the next round since it’s not going to matter what year these guys get tacked on to. We’re taking so damn long to finish this process anyway…

But really I just want Jr. and Mo in.

elkboy3

11 years ago

Edgar Martinez
John Olerud
Jamie Moyer

Hub Kid

11 years ago

Dale Murphy, Dave Stieb, Jamie Moyer

Wow- Lofton and Brown are doing pretty well in this Redemption Round after they won the first one.

A repeat is not against the stated rules, so I guess the same two winners could win. For my part, I’m not going to vote for them in this Redemption Round. I am going to vote for two other near-Greats and make up for not voting for Moyer in the 1962 round (although clearly Stieb and Brown had better careers).

Author

birtelcom

11 years ago

Reply to Hub Kid

Lofton is leading and Brown has strong support, but Edgar Martinez leads the race for that second spot right now. Edgar was still on the regular ballot during the last redemption round so was not in need of redemption last time. There were some immediate regrets expressed at the time Edgar dropped off the ballot.

Hartvig

11 years ago

Reply to birtelcom

For me, Martinez is the one I’m fairly certain belongs. I went from on-the-fence to fairly certain about Lofton at one point but since then some things that I’ve come to understand about Rfield have led me to move him back on to the fence along with Brown.

There are several guys that we have passed over in this process that I’m a big fan of and more than a few that I feel belong in the Hall of Fame but aren’t. But for the COG at least, the 3 I listed are the only ones I’m still considering.