“Was that a record?”

Those tuned in to ESPN for the almost-opener in Miami heard Dan Shulman say that the 2011 Cardinals had 9 different pitchers record at least 1 save.

What’s your gut sense — was that an all-time record? The point here is not to look it up (that’s my job!), but just to say what you think.

(By the way, Shulman was mistaken; only 8 different Cardinals got a save last year, and that includes the postseason, where Jason Motte got all 5 saves. But for the sake of discussion, let’s pretend he was right.)

0 0 votes
Article Rating
Subscribe
Notify of
guest

34 Comments
Oldest
Newest Most Voted
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Luis Gomez
Luis Gomez
12 years ago

I think that during the early days of baseball, when saves were not an official stat, a lot of starters were used to save games, making it not unusual to have several pitchers with at least one save. On the other hand, staffs were smaller than today’s, so I have no idea 🙂 My guess is a few 70’s teams are close, but overmatched by last year’s Cards.

Tmckelv
Tmckelv
12 years ago
Reply to  Luis Gomez

the smaller staffs, like you said, (many teams didn’t even have 10 pitchers) and the much higher percentage of complete games would rule out the early years of Baseball (purely a guess by me).

oneblankspace
oneblankspace
12 years ago

Off the top of my head, the 1983 White Sox won 99 games. Dennis Lamp was their leader with 15 saves (Salome Barojas had 13). They may have had more firemen with saves than the ’11 Cards.

(They also had a local telecast for the games in the ALCS opposite the network telecast.)

Timmy Pea
Timmy Pea
12 years ago
Reply to  oneblankspace

They shared the same manager as the ’11 Cardinals also!

Wine Curmudgeon
12 years ago
Reply to  John Autin

One can never have too many Clash references on a baseball blog.

Timmy Pea
Timmy Pea
12 years ago

I found this fact amazing and hadn’t heard it before. The Rays committed 73 errors in 2011, the fifth-fewest ever by an American League team.

Hartvig
Hartvig
12 years ago

I’m going to guess that it’s not a record. Given the combination of 12 & 13 man pitching staffs, players getting sent down or called up, trades, etc. plus as easy as it is to get credit for a save- I’m thinking someone has had at least 10 different pitchers qualify.

Just on a whim I checked the Braves of the first half of the ’90’s.

In 1991 and ’92 both they had 8 different guys record a save- but they topped that in 1990, with 9 guys.

bstar
12 years ago
Reply to  Hartvig

Sorry to go off-topic guys, but for clarification Hartvig did you say Ray Narleski was your avatar pic?

bstar
12 years ago
Reply to  John Autin

Thanks for the great words by James….and the clarification. My brain gets slow when my evening dose of thorazine kicks in.

Hartvig
Hartvig
12 years ago
Reply to  John Autin

I actually have a clear memory of opening a pack of baseball cards as a kid and thinking: “Man, is that guy ugly!”

I have to admit that he wasn’t a particular hero of mine as a kid, even though he was a pretty successful starter for the Tigers about the time I started following baseball, because at that age I was more taken by offensive players like Cash or Kaline.

It was the Bill James’ quotes that John refers too that got me thinking about him again.

bstar
12 years ago

I’m sensing that you already looked it up, John, and it’s not a record. Gut sense? I’m kinda 50/50 on it, to be honest. I can’t remember when the save stat became official(late 70’s?). Sure, they used bullpens differently back in the 70s but starting pitchers got more CGs back then, too, so I’m torn.

Ed
Ed
12 years ago
Reply to  John Autin

And yet that chaos featured a HOF manager and another who probably should be in the HOF.

Doug
Doug
12 years ago
Reply to  John Autin

The 1959 and 1961 Kansas City A’s set the record. In 1962, they signed a 17-year-old named… Tony LaRussa. The next year, they signed another 17-year-old named… Dave Duncan.

Tmckelv
Tmckelv
12 years ago
Reply to  John Autin

Unbelievably the early 1970’s rangers came to mind because i was thinking they had 1 good season in there when they weren’t typically a good team – I am not sure if that was even 1973 though. one of the Billy Martin teams. I was thinking early 1970’s as I mentioned down below when I went on my Big Red Machine discussion. and then thinking of a team with a lot of wins that wasn’t used to winning so they might not have had a set bullpen. My thinking could not have been more faulty as the 1973 rangers only… Read more »

birtelcom
Editor
12 years ago

PI also tells us that 43 teams have had 10 or more pitchers with a save during a season. And that two teams, the 1968 Angels and the 1965 AL pennant-winning Twins, had nine different pitchers with more than one save.

kds
kds
12 years ago

The save became an official stat in 1969, almost identical to the rule today. Later, people went back and figured saves going back to the beginning of ML history. The rules used were broader than in 1969, most games in which the winning pitcher was not the last pitcher for the winning team would result in saves. We have to remember that even the fireman role, before the closer role, was fairly recent. Before the 1960’s teams frequently did not concentrate their most important relief outings to one pitcher. Of course earlier the relief ace was just the ace. Christy… Read more »

Tmckelv
Tmckelv
12 years ago

Note: I am writing this prior to reading any comments in case the answer is written already. So please ignore if redundant/ridiculous. The record would probably come from a time period when there were a lot of relievers used but before the closer era (sometime in the early 1970’s). A team with a lot of wins but not a lot of complete games (Captain Hook – Sparky Anderson). I don’t really have concrete examples, but I am thinking Early Big Red Machine – although I do know Clay Carroll led the NL in Saves one year. Also, this thinking is… Read more »

Hartvig
Hartvig
12 years ago
Reply to  Tmckelv

The wins part especially doesn’t seem to correlate at all. My guess of the early ’90 Braves was right in ’91 & ’92 when they were winning but they had even more in ’90 when they were dead last and only won 65 games. I’m sure by now you’ve seen the answer but I’m guessing those early Kansas City and Texas teams didn’t win a lot more than that either. I imagine the moral of the story is: if you’re going to win with a crappy bullpen you’d better have some pretty decent starting pitching. Your mention of Captain Hook… Read more »

topper009
topper009
12 years ago

I would like to chime in about the telecast…it was terrible. In the first inning Berkman had a close tag play on his double, no replay. Next inning, close pickoff play, no replay. Later on, I forget who but someone hit a little nubber up the 1B line, Kyle Lohse waited for it to go foul but when he touched the ball it was CLEARLY fair from the replay. The ball was blocked by Lohse’s leg so I think that’s why the ump missed it, but no one in the booth even mentioned it…it would have been the first hit… Read more »

topper009
topper009
12 years ago
Reply to  John Autin

Good point, if it was true it would have been the first time I actually learned something about baseball while watching anything on ESPN.

Strasburg will be on WGN later today

bstar
12 years ago
Reply to  topper009

Topper, I too was yelling at the TV when they didn’t show an extra shot of Berkman’s great slide. I still don’t know if he was actually safe.